crmzendrgone

It has been a long time sense i have been able to get on. Glad to be back. I just bought a 98 cirrus, it was find when i test drove it. Now first thing in the morning when i start it put it in reverse it goes in reverse then sputers and then stall; while it is doing that the check engine light flickers on and off and the gauges' needles dance around. ANYONE know what is causing this? Thanks ahead of time.

scotts74birds

Ok, this is my element. Start with ALL the connections to the battery, even the ones hidden in the left wheelwell where the battery is. Also I assume you back out to the driveway? Try parking it the other way, lets find if its the reverse or forward, or any vibration in the morning. Check the connections at the ECU, and the PCM. Check the mounting of these as the screws are used for gounding their chassis. If it was only instruments, lights and guages goofing up and no stalling, I might lean to the body control module. Lets start with all connections and grounds first. Btw, I own 2 of them w/over 200k on them, do all my own work, and work in the factory that built them. I just might have picked up 1 or 2 things about them!

crmzendrgone

cool i will try those suggestions. glad top have you as a resource and of course fellow MOPAR fan.

crmzendrgone

Ok this car is diven by my daughter so getting acturate info is well work in progress. So now the car is fine backing out but after a minute or two of driving it will act up, going forward while trying to acellerate the car bucks and surges and the speedometer needle drops then shows the speed then drops and the check engine light still filckers once it is done throwing its little fit it is fine.

scotts74birds

Okay the "gauges dancing around" in the first post threw me a little. Whats the tach doing? Now you say just the speedo is bouncing. That clears it up alittle. Which motor is this? My 2.5 v6 has 208k and still dont burn oil, great motor. Do you have a Haynes manual for the car yet? Buy one, it will save you thousands. I'm not a parts changer and always believe in RTFM! I'm starting to lean towards a cam or crank position sensor. The failure of these will usually start as a buck or stumble feeling at high speeds, or a stall a low speeds. At first it will restart immediately, then it will happen more often, then it will take longer to restart. This process can go on for weeks. Finally it will just fail. Ive used Pro-Scan OBDII software on my laptop but was unable to diagnose with it. You might want to try the free scans that most auto part stores offer, like autozone. Dont be surprised if it tells you nothing. These sensors are used as inputs to the computer like a logic ladder. If a, b or c isnt there, it wont tell d to execute. This means you wont get fuel or spark {symptoms that will mislead you!} because the right conditions have not been met. Im an electrician and I was finally able to find that when hot, the crank pos sensor would not send a pulse to the computer. When I removed the sensor {CAREFULLY!!} I found heat damage to the end of it. Heat damage can cause the sensor to expand and and make one-piece removal very difficult! This is all meant to assist you in troubleshooting, i'm not saying run out to the driveway and start replacing things. I'm laid off and broke now so I believe in doing your homework and not being a parts changer. I hope I put you on the right path.

crmzendrgone

I use to work at a chrysler dealer so i am aware of not just throwing parts at it but, drivabilty i was not always working on thats why i am scratching my head thanks i look into them.

crmzendrgone

ok, i checked the connections they're good. i myself drove it and it seems to act like you shut it off real quick and back on again just long enough to loose (ignition?) but the spinning of the engine keeps it going enough for it to turn right over again. it is a 2.5 it only seems to do it first thing after it has run for a while it does not act up after that. i need to drive it one more time and really pay attention to all the symptoms casue it does not do it long enough to diagnose. what i did see is all the other gauges show what they should just the speedo drops but it is instant drops but jumps right back up to the correct speed. i forgot where the crank is, it is on the back or right side of the trans right? near the flexplate?

scotts74birds

Correct for the crank sensor location, on the trans, under the distributor. Very hard to reach. Correct on the engine restarting itself. I wouldnt recommend taking the crank sensor out just to check it cause there is a sacrificial tape installed from the factory that establishes the proper gap between it and the rotating part, that wears off at initial startup. It would be hard to set that gap again. Fleeting problems are the worst. The kicker is that you say the speedo drops off. That I believe is driven of the transmission output speed sensor. There is also an input speed sensor. A failure in these would usually cause the trans to lock into 2nd gear for the limp-home mode in the 41te transes. I asked the local Napa what they sold alot of and the answer was the speed sensors and the cam and crank sensors.

crmzendrgone

ok my daughter told me today while making a left turn out of a parking lot that the car seemed to just coast while she was giving it gas, she said that the engine went fast but the car just coasted, translation i believe she pressed the accelerator and the RPMs raised but she had no forward motion. And the final one was while at a stop light she had her foot on the brakes and the engine stubbled and when the enging brought the RPMs back up the car learched forward and she had to press the pedal harder to stop. so after hearing this we went for a drive and i witnessed the stubble while driving JUST THE SPEEDO DROPS and the tach lowers but then raise like as if you were giving it more fuel by that i mean the tach dropped like one or two hundred rpms, i also witness the stubble at a stop and she had to press the brakes harder to hold it there, but i believed that to be cause the booster lost vaccuum and then when the computer brought the rpms back up there was not enough pressure to hold it, i could be way wrong but like i said i do not know drivibility that well. i can get those paper spacers from where i use to work for the crank sensor. i myself am leaning toward the the crank sensor but i am unsure. i think i may have to take it to the drivibility guy i use to work with he is a S.E.A.L. tech for chyrsler. I would still appreciate your knowledge. but these are the concrete facts on what the vehicle is doing. THANKS LOTS FOR THE HELP!!!!!

crmzendrgone

A month or so back the daughter got in an accident in the Cirrus, nothing major just fender bender. Sense the accident I noticed a coolant leak and the always been there oil leak. So I put it up on the ramps looked under it to find that one of the core plugs was leaking and the oil pan was leaking. So I decided while having to do the core plug might as well flush the coolant. Popped the cap to find nothing but "mud" rust water in the system so I went ahead and replaced the crusted up thermostat too. So removed the oil pan to find that the previous owner (maybe before that even, the vehicle was bought at auction by the lady's husband that I purchased it from) decided to make sure the curb was really there and bent in the oil pan and bent up the oil pick up tube. So I banged out the oil pan had to wait a week for the pickup tube. While waiting during the accident the right front head lamp just disappeared into thin air so says the daughter so when to the local pick a part and got a head lamp for $14. I should have got the pickup tube there also would have been cheaper, oh well. So got it all back together and remembered that while performing the flush I had it running and the idle starting getting really slow like as though the engine was getting bogged down. Or flooded would be better description didn't think nothing of it then until I was running it last night and noticed a hissing noise. So I sprayed some carb clean on the EGR valve and it stalled out and died. So here is the point to this long post. Can an EGR cause the above mentioned symtoms in this thread of stalling and then dieing. Oh I saw that the EGR tube to the intake looked loose (like there was a gap between the flange and the valve [I think the gasket is crap] so I tightened the bolst and they turned at least 2 full turns if not more.

Well drove it last night parked it check it this morning and there were some drips on the floor. They look like transmission fluid. I think that the tranny cooler lines are leaking and the drips are getting blown back onto the pan, by the front timing cover where the oil pan meets it. There is also a little drip on the floor right under the left front of vehicle which is where the cooler lines are. Also the trans pan is leaking to cause it fell victim to the curb check to. Sorry for the long post. Thanks for any input!

Polaradude

Clearly Mr. Scott we need more power from the warp drive.
I am gonna be screwed when god forbid there are no more carbs and timing lights.
A whole lot of chinese going on here.

crmzendrgone

Ain't that the truth.

Just an update the symtoms have returned. So I still need to figure it out one day when she has time.

MrOldart2U

Gimmie carbs, and hell, even points....ANYDAY!!!!

stratsnhammonds

Mine started with what I called a 'hiccup' at highway speeds, just every once in a great while, for no apparent reason. Then came stalling at stoplights, with increasing frequency. Then this past weekend it got me and my gear to our gig just fine, but after unloading at the front doors, I started the car to re-park and it barely ran enough to limp into another parking space and hasn't started since. It sits straddling two spaces at a local hockey arena.

I was initially very fired up, thinking I might have gotten ripped off on the fuel pump that I paid a shop too much to install about 8 months ago, since I pulled the fuel line off the fuel rail while a friend turned the key for a minute and nothing came out. Now I'm thinking that the prior weeks' symptoms were more in line with the excellent description quoted above, and my lack of observable fuel flow is a result of "ladder logic" in the car's brain.

So, my question is this, is it possible I might get one more start out of it and be able to drive it home, save myself an expensive tow and buy myself some time/save money to put towards later fixing the actual problem?

Mine never really went through a period where the starts got harder and harder, so I'm hoping she's got one more in her if I go back and charge the battery back up. If I have to have the car towed, it'll have to be towed to my home as there's no way I can pay a shop for work right now. Then, down the road, I'll probably have to pay for another tow to get it to a shop to have the work done. I've done lots of my own work, but I think messing with crank and/or cam positioning sensors is probably a little above my pay grade and tool box.

Sorry for the lengthy first post. Found this forum googling for info on my problem. I have two Cirruses (cirri?), a '96 and a '97, both with the v6, and really like them, despite their sometimes frustrating behavior. I've learned a ton about car repair from owning them because they're too old and high miles to justify paying a ton at a shop but still too much car to just junk out when something breaks. So for every dollar I've put into them, I've gotten serious educational value.

I'm very glad to have found this forum, and I'm sure I'll be getting plenty of use out of it in the future. Thanks to all posters and experts for the info I've already gleaned, and thanks in advance for any help with my situation.

Dylan