Points to Electronic Ignition- $REWARD$ for a solution!!
 

Hello again! :)


I'm having an intermittent issue. When I had the 383 rebuilt, I decided to go with the Proform 66993 Electronic Ignition.

Things were fine for the first 300 miles. Then all of a sudden. It'll die or flat out not start.

Things I've done:

Changed the voltage regulator
Changed the alternator
Changed the ignition coil

It's definitely an electrical issue, BUT I am whits end! :banghead:

Here's the weird part, when it dies, I lose all power, no headlights no NOTHING!


My questions:

Does anyone have a picture of how they wired their electronic ignition from going to points?

If someone does have a pic I just need to see how its wired.

If it is the ECU, how can I test it? If it was bad, it would not allow me to lose all power right?

:banghead:

10.00 Paypal to the person who can help me fix this!

............................L..................... ......let's.........................sllllllllloooo oooowwwwww..................ddddddooooooowwwwwwwnn nnn

OK? Calm down take a few breaths. About half of what you are saying makes no sense at all

WHON..........Please post the destructions for the Proform wiring

TEUW..........You say you

Changed the voltage regulator
Changed the alternator
Changed the ignition coil

which doesn't make much sense, because a car should run FINE with the regulator and alternator laying on the garage floor

THAREE...You said

"when it dies, I lose all power, no headlights no NOTHING!"

which MIGHT ACTUALLY BE a clue to the issue

FAOUR...You said

"Does anyone have a picture of how they wired their electronic ignition from going to points?"

This is meaningless because we don't know what you are working on, nor do we know what you/ them/ it/ he/ she/ I have for electronic ignition

=========================================

SO

ALPHA..............WHAT YEAR MAKE AND MODEL IS YOUR automobile / rig /vehicle / tractor?

BETA.................As I said earlier, post the destructions for what this Proform is, how it should be
wired, and how you wired it

GAMMA.............LOSING ALL POWER. This here might be "the deal." Again, what year make
and model is your car? You may have a bulkhead connector / fuse link /
ammeter connection problem.

GPsD -

Check the battery terminals (and cables).
Remove/clean/re-tighten.

Archer

Perfect>>>>>>> What he said..... Then we can put you to work.... :)

It could be alot of things but as 440 said we need more info..Things it could be from what you were saying is: If it dies and wont restart with "no power or nothing" It sounds like a battery positive or ground issue or a ignition feed wire...The first place I would look would be the feed wire to the ign. switch..but that still doesnt explain the headlights..So it sounds more like a positive battery wire feeding the fusible link cluster/connector....Bill

What is bulkhead?

The bulkhead / firewall connector, and in these old girls, it causes a LOT of problems.

Read this article:

http://www.madelectrical.com/electri...p-gauges.shtml

from what i hear changing the cars over all elec system to an electric regulator is not really needed. if the the bat voltage stays where it needs to be. i got it from a chrysler factory rep. on the elec ignition system do get two extra ballast resistors and put them in the glove. at the first time you have a no start, just swap out the ballast under the hood.

I hope you saw my other answers-


1968 Chrysler Newport 383 4 Barrel


I'm liking this idea/thought/suggestion. I did notice some taping at the bulkheads.


I also like the ballast resistor theory too.

I have brand a new battery but will look at the connections

That would only be in a no spark condition..just to clarify...Bill:)

Test light and a wiggle test....:hello:

Bob you are leaving yourself wide open for come backs but I'll let this one slide:laugh::laugh:..Bill

GPsD -

You're getting a lot of good information and some fluff.
First off, you're getting a global electrical shutdown, so you have to think basic - it ain't a secondary loose wire.

That's why you start at the battery and work up and down stream. Unfortunately, you have to wait until it happens again to diagnose it. When it dies, check the battery voltage (terminal to terminal) and repeat after "jumps" or connections both on the positive and negative ends. Voltage drop should be minimal. When you find the dead spot, the connection right before it is the culprit.

Like Bob said, test light (or multimeter) and wiggle.
Just remember, we're not looking for a minor voltage drop, we're looking for "dead".

With global shutdowns, it has to be pretty basic.

Archer

Thanks for keeping it real and basic as you say- I do appreciate everyone's input though, cause well...you just never know.:doh: Overlooking is easy to do.. Electrical is so tricky, temperamental, hard to trace!


My initial thought is YES it's GOT TO BE SOMETHING EASY! And I am sure it is and when I find it, :doh::doh::doh:

Ballast resistor, seems to tickle my interest: Why?

I DONT KNOW! I am still stumped.

The ballast might stop the ignition from working BUT THIS will not cause the problem you describe losing all power

LOOK CAREFULLY at the article I posted, the MAD article. This has a very good simplified diagram of how the basic power works in these cars, unmodified:

http://www.madelectrical.com/electri...p-gauges.shtml

Go down the page, there and look at that diagram

Power for the car follows this path, follow along: From the battery to the "big stud" on the starter relay. From that stud, through the fuse link, through the bulkhead connector and through the firewall into the interior of the car. CHECK RIGHT THERE.

Then power goes to the ammeter CHECK THERE. The ammeter should be "hot" at all times.

NOTICE they go through the ammeter, then changes to a black wire and goes to the WELDED SPLICE. This is a splice in the black ammeter wire up under the dash cluster. This is taped up in the harness a few inches from the ammeter. It is rare, but this harness can come loose. Save this for last

WIGGLE the bulkhead connector with the headlights ON. If you get the headlights to blink or go out, you are likely in the right area

As someone said, CLEAN THE battery terminals.

http://www.madelectrical.com/electri...s/amp-ga18.jpg

Do yourself a HUGE favor..........

Go here...........

http://www.forabodiesonly.com/mopar/...p?p=1970088617

and here.......

http://www.mymopar.com/index.php?pid=31

And find and download yourself a FREE factory service manual


Now I realize that MyMopar does not list one exactly for your car, but if you download, say, the 69 Plymouth manual........

http://www.mymopar.com/downloads/ser...ice_Manual.zip

.........and use the "big" car wiring diagrams, this will get you close. In addition, a lot of the stuff pertaining to engines, etc will be the same. Best thing you could do for you and your car is to search and and find and buy the proper service manual. You can find these both "on CD" and "reprint paper" around the internet

Also, MyMopar has simplified wiring diagrams. These are not always completely accurate, and do not show all the optional stuff especiall on the Chryslers

http://www.mymopar.com/downloads/1968/68ChryslerA.JPG

http://www.mymopar.com/downloads/1968/68ChryslerB.JPG

Below, I have attached two small segments of the two diagrams posted above, with yellow dots following the main power distro. This follows the simplified diagram which the MAD article shows. It is important to realize that these diagrams, do NOT split the pages "at the firewall." Follow along. Start at the battery. The yellow dots show the power going from the battery to the starter relay stud. This is merely a junction point in this case. From there will be a smaller wire with the fuse link (fuse wire) and this goes through the bulkhead connector. Through terminal "J" of the connector, the RED wire goes to the left off the page.

On the next diagram, the red wire goes to the left to the little block to the far left, which is your ammeter. There it changes color, and comes back to the right on BLACK wire. At the far right of the page, notice that it BRANCHES OFF. This is the welded splice

From there it goes several places............The headlight switch, the ignition switch, the fuse "hot buss", and off through the firewall terminal "P" and goes to the alternator output stud. On some cars, one or two other places

THE MAIN AREAS OF CONCERN

BATTERY CONNECTIONS

BATTERY CABLES

THE FUSE WIRE

THE BULKHEAD CONNECTOR TERMINALS

Less probable

Connections at the ammeter

Failure of the ammeter itself

Failure of the "welded splice"

My money's on the starter stud. I'm betting on a loose connection...

Also, always take off wedding rings and such when working on this stuff. It may be only 12 volts, but I've seen it weld ratchet wrenches into paperweights. Safety first.

PROBLEM SOLVED
 

Guess what it was!


There was short at the FUSE BOX under the dash! :slap:


I ran out of daylight- but when I twisted it around, suddenly I hear a click, click. So I proceeded to turn the key- and she started right up! Then WHILE it was running I jiggled the the fuse box- poof- it DIED no lights no power no nothing!


SO the question is to all who have followed this post, FIRST of all thank you all for giving me hints, thoughts, opinions. BUT who do thinks they should receive the reward? I know it's only 10 bux BUT y'all took time to respond. I'm taking a vote:

Who was the closest to the solution?

GPsD -

Why don't you use it to fix the fuse box or at least get a pair of fuzzy dice?
It had to be the lead into the box, right?

Archer

:dance:..... Just fix the dam car..:duck:

GLAD you found it.... Now on to the next problem... What ever that might be...
Thanks for the feedback.... Happy cruising......

:)

I'm very sorry to have to tell you this...............you have not 'fixed' it. The headlights do NOT go through the fuse box.

PLEASE read what I posted. REPEAT The headlights do NOT go through the fuse box.

This problem is STILL IN the car

Either you have a bad connection i

the fuse link

the bulkhead connector

or the welded harness splice

AND THAT BAD CONNECTION

is still right there

I'm very sorry to say

You have not fixed it.

That sir is yet TBD, I have not had the time or daylight to pinpoint BUT I did find the actual location at that is the fuse box. You're right though, it has to be the lead that goes into the fuse box, was that your suggestion?
Fuzzy dice- hmm..I think you're onto something there!

I think you are right..although I hope you are not.. but if I am twisting/jiggling the fuse box while the car is running, and it turns off, would this not be semi-indicative of the issue?

Your on to it.... Find that gremlin and kill it !!!!!

The ignition does not go through the fuse box. Look over what I posted. As you wiggle the fuse panel, you are also moving something else without realizing it. You are either moving the bulkhead connector or the ammeter connection, or the "welded splice." This is the only three things it can possibly be, unless someone has "hacked" the wiring.

Look very carefully at that "MAD" diagram which even though simplified, accurately depicts just exactly how the basic main power is distributed

Power comes off the battery, and goes through the fuse link, and through one terminal of the bulkhead connector

STOP RIGHT THERE

These bulkhead terminal connectors are very prone to destruction READ the MAD article. WIGGLE the bulkhead connector, inside and out. That right there could be the problem.

NEXT, power goes up to the ammeter

STOP

Power has FIVE points of interest, there!!!! two wire crimp connectors!!! two stud and nut connectors!!! and the "guts" of the ammeter. Each and every one of those FIVE individual points can fail!!! Gingerly move your hand up there and "carefully" feel for heat with the headlights on. "Move" and "wiggle" things around. Watch for things stop working

NEXT. Is the welded splice in the ammeter wire. There is not much you can do, except "save it for last. THESE DO FAIL. If you check everything else and satisfy yourself that everything else is FOR SURE good, you are going to have to attack the welded splice. In my lifetime, I'm aware of at least 6 or 8 of these that have failed. Over on another board, in the last couple of years, there's been two that been found failed.

LOOK AT the "MAD" diagram. The "welded splice is taped up, in the harness, up in the dash harness, a few inches from the ammeter in the black ammeter wire. LOOK at what comes off there. It feeds power FROM the ammeter TO

the headlights

the fuse panel

the ignition switch

NOTICE that NEITHER the headlights nor ignition goes through the fuse panel.

http://www.madelectrical.com/electri...s/amp-ga18.jpg

The fuse box is fed by a fusible link and if you follow it back it will be spliced into a bunch of fusible links. Under the hood of the car...When you play with the fuse box it is pulling enough on the fusible links to break the connection/battery feed to the fuse box,headlights, ignition feed,Etc...Nobody want the reward we all help each other out here and enjoy doing it...We are all like family here..We hurt when someone is hurting and rejoice when someone is happy and is motoring...Bill

All Great Info.... Just have to dig for it.....:)