I put the pump in and the car runs different accelerates better but most importantly it makes the problem stand out even more! Half throttle 3200 rpms it's like I hit max rpms engine stops advancing and slows down it's exactly like hitting a rev limiter and that's it almost like it cuts fuel out and everything. I'll work on getting a points distributor next.

I'm just curious how will a points distributor help? I'll get one in a minute but I have never messed with one before.

There's a clip of it. That's second gear. I'll get a idle rev vid also.

Free rev then I tried to get it above 3 grand doing a burnout in the grass.

The point distributor would help in terms that there would be no doubt that it works. If the dwell meter shows 30 degrees, and you have a verified coil, there is no doubt that it works, at least up to 4500-5000 rpm. The electronic staff, even though works very consistent when it does, it is hard to diagnose when it acts up.


But I did look at your video. It is really hard to tell what is happening. As soon as the engine stalled, it seems that you put it in neutral, right? What would have happened if you stayed in gear, and stayed on the gas? The whole thing does look similar to my fuel starvations, but if your fuel pressure gage was showing 6 psi WHILE your engine was stalling, then it cannot be fuel starvation.


The engine sounds good though. Was this full throttle? Is the speedometer calibrated?

If I stay in gear and on the gas nothing happens it drags really bad because it's at 3k plus rpms like downshifting a car but the gas pedal is like it's broken. I don't know how else to explain it but it's exactly like running a modern car to redline and then it rejects you my little Saturn is a stick and of I run it to 6500 rpms it's like it kills the gas pedal and the car drags like downshifting that's all. I pulled it out of gear so it didn't drag. No the speedo is not calberated. I need a different gear for that. I was thinking maybe my rpm gauge is wrong but I can't seem to find a problem when I compare it to my timing light rpm reading. I do not have aftermarket springs in this distributor yet should I try that? Also I checked everything electrical with this and te charging system is working great I have the proper power to the ballast. The only thing I'm hesitant on is maybe my single ballast conversion is wired slightly wrong causing a high rpm voltage cut out? I've been trying to read a lot about this but I don't know if what I just said makes any sense. I'm also looking for wiring diagrams for the single ballast. This car was originally a dual ballast but my ignition kit came with a single ballast so I used that. I'm also starting to wonder if the ECU little ignition box isn't junk..... That is the ignition brain right? Kinda strange I would have 2 ignition boxes be junk on me though but the first box was the origonal black one. I just changed the spark plugs also.

No, I was not suggesting that your tach is bad, I was just curious about your gearing, and rate of acceleration. In fact, the tach seems consistent with the sound of the engine.


I have zero experience with electronic ignitions. So, I cannot help you there. As you know, your problem is either ignition or fuel. Since you have stable fuel pressure and no black smoke on the back, I cannot see how it can be fuel.


A points distributor is probably about $100 on any autopart store.

Thinking out loud here. Manual so good throttle test with no trans variables, sounds like three thousand rpm, sounds like engine electrics QUIT, no ping so timing is ok even if not perfect. First thought is engine torque is twisting it enough to pull at some electrical connection somewhere stopping voltage (maybe a ground too) to the ignition system.

Then I thought your "feels like down shifting" which would happen only if the throttle blades closed, if throttles were open and ignition quit being a manual it would just coast quietly.

To happen the same every time only under load has me thinking something mechanical as the engine torques.

Changing control box, not a bad idea, not too expensive and you'd have a spare for future but would not answer distributor question.

Changing to points distributor, I probably would and what the hell if I was still a big block guy I'd have a spare for breaking in cams or starting used engines I might buy.

First thing I would check is wire slack and probably chain down the engine and do another full throttle acceleration test.

I'd run two wires from coil and bat ground into the cab to my volt meter and see if voltage changes at that rpm when it quits.

Stick with it man and when you solve this you'll be our hero. Your steering wheel and dash is giving me flash backs when I drove my car years ago. Good Luck.

i cant remember the transmission gearing but its a 1969 4 speed 23 spline. 3:73 rear ends with posi. that was a full throttle vid but only for a second i dont floor it for more than a second really just because im afraid. i dont want to damage the engine or clutch its all brand new. the motor does have a decent amount of putting time on it but its around the yard putting and idle time. I will be getting a points distributor here in a few days i have to wait for it but in the mean time im checking the cam timing. Long story but here it goes ill sum it up! origonally the car was an auto TCI built 727 with a believe a 2500 stall or 3000 stall. anyways i cant remember what happened but we had the timing light hooked up to the engine reading RPMS. somehow and for some reason a screw driver fell in the carb i cant remember if my dad flooded the motor and put the screw driver in it to open the choke or whatever he does with that screw driver but it fell down in the carb throttle body i guess you would call it? But the screw driver held the carb open and the engine spun 6200 rpms in a blink of an eye im not kidding it was insanely fast we almost pooped ourselves. i drove the car home and around town for about 11 miles then the transmission pump bearing got all chewed up and wrecked my transmission so i did the 4 speed swap but i did take the engine back apart when i took it out. Installed 440 source 426 hemi connecting rods had everything from the balancer to the flywheel balanced. I was busy when the engine was being assembled so i left my dad to do it all. Yesterday i showed him a timing gear set and asked what dots he lined up and if he really did line up the 2 marks he says he did then the timing is off. I will know tonight if the timing is off. I have to head to school in 15 minutes here. Its a shame i can work on modern engines with no problem but this old stuff can confuse the crap out of me for some reason! But anyways the point of this story was i used to spin 3k plus cruising this car when it was auto now it will only do 3500? i think we assembled something wrong. I will still be buying the points distributor.

Generally, old cars are much easier to work on. No electronic garbage, better accessibility. They are also more forgiving.


If your cam timing was way off, the pistons would be hitting the valves. If it was somewhat off, your engine would run real bad at any speed. Cam timing is not your problem at this point. Taking everything apart in the front to get to the timing chain is a lot of work.

Well.... I found out today the timing was set to R4 so retarded 4 degrees? I reset it I will start the car tomorrow and see what happens. I'm sure I will have to adjust timing and the carb now?

A retarded timing will give you a bit more low end, at the expense of a bit of upper end.


May be some changes in the idle mixture. But I do not think you have ran the engine at the upper rev ranges yet in order to set the jets. As you recall, the jets is what controls the mixture when you drive, the idle mixture screws only adjust idle mixture.


You have also never reached the point to optimize your timing. Once you eliminate your engine cut-out, then may be you can try to optimize the system ...

Disagree. It's time to check cam timing. I have not read this entire thing, but if you know "some idea" of the cam specs you can estimate if the cam is close in time by using a degree wheel. That is you don't need to tear the engine down only remove the driver side valve cover.

There was one other thread on here where a guy with an "advance / retard" timing drive used the wrong marks. In addition to the markings, you SHOULD use a degree wheel when installing, at any rate.

I have to tell you that I did not get much out of those videos. You need to get somebody else in the car, a flat stretch of unused road (early morn, late eve) and make a "pull" from a low speed to whatever it will make. Say, 2nd gear. Do this enough that we can get a feel for what's happening

You sound to me as if YOU HAVE NOT got a real idea of what the timing is, and where it's going. You MUST MUST check the timing. You MUST verify that the timing marks are correct and what the timing is doing. This is an absolute necessity. If you are running vacuum advance, plug it off until you find the problem.

While we are in agreement that it is important to know where the cam timing is, and it is also important to work on the spark timing, these issues cannot be causing the engine to stall. It seems to me that he needs to fix that problem before he should worry about perfect timing and exacting the cam timing to how he wants it.

Holy crap everytime I write a paragraph my phone flips and deletes everything!

I will reply with details in a few hours when I get to a computer. I think I confused everyone with the cam timing. I'll explain.

The engine is stalling? Where did I miss that? I was under the impression it was losing HP at high RPM

ok heres what was wrong. the timing gear on the crank was set to zero which was correct. BUT! he did not line the dots up correctly. instead of using the dot on the crank pulley he used the zero mark for the crank timing so the cam pulley was roughly lined up with R4. that was about 5 teeth behind the actual timing mark that should have been used on the crank gear. the car runs amazing now it dialed right in with the timing the carb tuned in great ive been using the vacuum gauge checking the idle mixture. This thing is a blast with the 4 speed. I should have taken the other guys advice and chained the engine down though. I put a dent in my passenger side header because the engine hit something to do with the suspension. i will throw some advance curve springs in the distributor next i also have to replace my spark plug wires with some that i cut myself.

I had already checked the timing a million times prior to checking the cam timing. I basically even replaced the entire ignition including wires. This thing runs amazing now. Thanks for the help.

I will have to post a little walk around video or pictures of the car so you can all see my never ending project now. ill try to get a nice acceleration video also. It had no problem burrying the 120 on the dash but that speedo isnt synchronized to the transmission either so i dont know how fast i was really going. Its finally complete!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! Thanks everyone and i know someone recomened to chain the engine down on here and i should have done that a whole ago now i have a dent in my header but i will be installing a chain soon aswell!!!!! Thanks again! I'll probably post a video on a separate forum or pictures of the car just to share.

You Sir have just earned a Non Refundable, Non Transferable ATTA BOY!

Well gee LOL what'd (I tried) to tell you

VERY glad you found this finally

Glad your engine does not stall any more. But it is hard to believe that an error in the cam timing can really cause the engine to stall completely.


If your original gear was 2.76, and the speedo was accurate at that time, and if you have the same tire size, your 120 indicated should be around 90.

timing
 

i have a 1974 dodge dart with new freshly rebuilt motor i cant find any timing info

Your welcome to start your own thread, please ask your questions and post information about motor transmission etc so we can help.