Darrin 57

Hi all,new to the site and have some questions on my 57 belvedere .I recently installed a 440 auto into the car and my question is about the mopar electronic conversion kit .
I installed it per the instructions online but when i turn on the key it cooks the ballast resistor ,if i disconnect the run wire from the ballast then connect to the pos coil side it sparks fine when i turn the key on and off it also wont cook the ballast.
I am using the stock starter sylinoid on the wheel well the insrtuctions tell you to run the start wire off the sylinoid to the ballast on the same terminal power from pos coil side ,black and yellow to neg coil side,and blue to the other ballast side which is were they tell you to run the run wire from the main ignition harness to that terminal on the ballast.Thats where i run into the ballast heating up at the sametime now I have power going to yhe starter signal wire to the starter sylinoid on the starter.Sorry for the long post thanks for having me Darrin

Silverick

Welcome to the forum! I don't have the answer for you but, I'm sure that someone can help you. There is some real knowledge here!

Darrin 57

Thanks,hopefully someone will chime in Darrin

440roadrunner

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EDIT READ this section first, as what I posted below may be partially incorrect for your car. Here's a diagram I found:

http://www.mymopar.com/downloads/1957/57PlymouthV8.JPG

If the diagram is correct, it shows the ignition feed is still dark blue, and the start wire is still yellow, but DOES NOT SHOW any means for "coil resistor bypass" circuit.

(For example, the black going off the alleged coil resistor to the kickdown relay. If this is true, it is truely weird. I would guess incorrect)

There are a couple of ways you could accomplish this. One would be to buy a general purpose automotive relay and wire it so the yellow start wire fires the relay along with the starter.

Then wire one of the relay contacts to battery, and the other IN PLACE OF my description of the brown wire in the section below

The second way to get around this would be to tap the yellow start wire at the start relay / solenoid, and run a wire from there to replace the brown described below WITH A SERIES DIODE which you could get from Radio Shack.

I'd buy a 10 or 20 amp rated diode. It will have a stripe on one end Wire it up: yellow at start relay ---diode-->|-- coil positive. The stripe must be on the end of the diode on the end hooked to the coil positive

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Those Instructions are WRONG or you misunderstood them. There can not be ANY connection from the starter relay to the ignition.

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NOTE INFO IN THE ++ MARKS are for later model cars does not apply to your old girl

Here's how Chrysler "stuff" works.

There are three important wires from the key to run the car.

1 Start relay usually yellow or close, comes from ignition switch in "start" and fires up starter relay. Relay will only fire if it is grounded (stick) or if clutch is depressed (70 and later stick) or if AUTO, then relay receives a ground through neutral safety switch

Starter relay then fires up solenoid on starter

2 At the same time "in start" a SECOND SEPARATE set of contacts feeds 12V out to the coil to bypass the ignition resistor, this wire is traditionally BROWN and Chrysler calls it "ignition 2"

When the key is released, both the above go dead, and the car:

3 Now the key fires up a dark blue called by Chrysler "ignition1" which is hot in run, and feeds the top end of the ignition resistor, the regulator, electric choke if equipped, and on 70 and later alternators, feeds one of the field connections.

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Can you post the instructions, or show the website associated with where you bought this system?

From this page, notice the simplified diagrams for "4 pin" and "5 pin" ECU. Here's the difference:

http://www.mymopar.com/index.php?pid=18

Early Mopar ECU's used a FOUR PIN RESISTOR which went with the early style ECUs now know as a FIVE PIN ECU. The 4 pin resistor was two sections: One section is exactly the same as it used to be on a points type system, and the other section was used internally by the old style "5 pin" ECU

Link for wiring a "5 pin ECU"

This diagram is not quite correct. In the top corner, the wire going to the resistor labeled "existing wire" hooks to your BLUE "ignition run" wire

What is not shown is the old "bypass" wire (brown) should be hooked to "coil positive"

ALSO the 4 pin resistor MUST be wired correctly, as the two sections are NOT the same. Hold the resistor as shown in the picture with the "open fork" in the ceramic down. The RIGHT side of the resistor must be wired to the COIL, and the LEFT side of the resistor must be wired to the ECU

http://www.mymopar.com/downloads/Ign...ystem_5pin.jpg

Below, the link for the newer "4 pin" ECU

This is also not quite complete. As before, the top right wire feeding the resistor hooks to your old blue "igniton run" wire, and once again, your old brown wire hooks to "coil positive."

http://www.mymopar.com/downloads/Ign...ystem_4pin.jpg

Newer ECU's DO NOT NEED the second resistor section and are known as a FOUR PIN ECU. These ECU's can use a TWO PIN resistor which looks just like the old points type resistors

IF YOU WIRE THE CAR for the older "5 pin ECU" (4 pin resistor) then you can use EITHER 5 or 4 pin ECU. If you ONLY wire up the 2 pin resistor, then you can ONLY use the newer 4 pin ECU.

Darrin 57

Thanks for reply I think part of the problem is that im using the stock 57 starter slinoid .In 57 they used a external silinoid on the wheel well it does not have the seperate signal wire like on my 70 challenger going to the starter .
I will replace the silinoid with a 70 starter relay also the old silinoid had the ground for the nuetral safety switch witch is one pin in 57 and 3 for the newer 727.That may pose a problem for that setup any thouhts?
On the ignition schematic i got online i think that was the the wrong set up like you said ,I have the four pin setup with the 5 pin connector with the green wire cutout .I will wire to the 4 pin schematic and go from there .Thank you for all your help Darrin

Darrin 57

Here is the link for the schematic Thanks Darrinhttp://www.google.com/imgres?imgurl=...ed=0CB4Q9QEwAw

440roadrunner

You cannot do what you propose. If the old solenoid is working, leave it on there. If it is not, post back to that affect and I'll walk you through. The thing is------that solenoid is wired for neutral safety.

Re--read my post. The best thing I know to do is add a second relay and use that second relay for the resistor bypass circuit, OR use a diode as I mentioned. For a relay, all you need is a good quality "parts store" relay used for fog/ driving lights, etc.

I neglected to explain WHY.

The start signal going to the ignition MUST BE a separate circuit from the solenoid. Here's why. When you have the car running, the current path is ignition switch --- coil resistor -- coil. If you have the start wire DIRECTLY from the solenoid to the coil positive, THE SOLENOID WILL act as a heavy load on the coil resistor "in run." (yellow wire in the diagram) This will not only cause a poor spark, but might just burn up the coil resistor.

UNTIL YOU GET that relay (or diode) wired up, you can try the car WITHOUT the wire from the start circuit. It may start OK.

So you could use what is commonly called a "Bosch relay:"



Below is what the bottom layout equates to terminal numbers. Go by the numbers, not the text labels:





which are standardised with the following terminal numbers:



So you could leave your old starter solenoid, mount the Bosch relay nearby, and wire as follows:

Wire no 85 to the "start" signal terminal on the existing starter solenoid

Hook no 86 to the existing solenoid terminal going to the neutral safety switch

Wire no 30 to the battery terminal on the existing starter solenoid

Wire no 87A to the "yellow" connection on your new ignition

Darrin 57

Thanks 440 roadrunner ,I will give it a shot soon .Thanks Darrin