Brother Mopar

After searching around for the last week or two and looking at articles and posts about 318 builds, I think Ive finally decided on a direction I might go with. Id appreciate any advice, whether it be supportive or verbally hitting me in the back of the head, sayin "Whaddya thinkin' about!??!" Im also looking at 360 builds, but havent gotten into that as much just yet. This is taken from one of the articles, so forgive any redundancy if youve seen it before.

Im looking to put it into a 73-74 Charger for near daily street use, so it cant be too extreme, but I dont mind losing some economy in exchange for some power as long as the engine is strong and reliable.

-Block: Not sure if it would be better to use an earlier or later block. The later have provisions for a hydraulic roller cam, but are a little thinner walled. Either way, clean it up and bore it .020 if possible, .030 if needed.

-Crankshaft: Use the stock cast crank. Clean, grind as necessary.

-Rods: Scat I Beam Rods. Maybe a bit overkill, but Ive heard a lot of good things.

-Pistons/Rings: Keith Black KB167 hyperuetectic pistons with matching moly ring set.

-Heads: High swirl 318(#302) castings upgraded to 1.88 intake/1.60 exhaust, plus 3 angle valve job and bowl blend.

-Cam: Possibly a Comp Cam XE275HL. Ive heard the XE268 with a 318 and might check that out too. Just started looking into cams though, so Im not sure just yet.

-Intake manifold: Weiand Action Plus-Just started checking this one out, but it was recommended by someone with a similar build.

-Carb: Edelbrock 650 cfm Thundr carb- Open to suggestions here since this was just mentioned in a 318 build article I read using a similar build.

-Exhaust: Open to suggestions here too. Ive had everything from honed stock manifolds to TTI headers recommended to me. Like I said, I want to create some power, but not kill any sort of economy as well.

ETC: Just quoting more from the main article I liked, but what about replacing stock rocker arms with stainless steel rollers

Brother Mopar

Also, should I look into machining the block to zero deck for more compression?

TVLynn

You don't need to O deck the block. You can do the same by using the correct pistons. That's not to say you shouldn't deck the block if for no other reason to make sure the block is square. I have done it on a 360, had .050 removed. That creates the need for custom intake fitment..I would keep compression around 9.5 for street motor. Stock rods rebuilt with ARP bolts are fine, scat rods would just be extra insurance if you are planning a high RPM motor

Coronet 500

With that piston (down .012 + .028 gasket) = 9.43 compression. Everything looks OK but if you use that big of cam check clearance to retainer and don't use cast manifolds as they will KILL the power you should make.

Over the last few years I've changed my thinking on cubic inches due to fuel costs. A nice 318c.i. can make 300 h.p. easy, if it's a 360c.i. make 350-400 h.p. if you like.

These discussions always go, if your thinking about 318 don't waste your time put in a 360. Hey, if your going with a 360 then stroke it and make more power in the same package. If you want an RB then build for 500 h.p. and get 6-8 mpg.

Lately I'm leaning toward small cubes turbocharged. I guess what I'm saying is set your goal and don't deviate from it. Fuel prices sure wont be coming down.

Skwerly

If you can find a block/heads from a ’68, they are a great base to start with because they put out some punch from the factory. Numbers were 230 horse and 340 torque; with a cam, bigger valves, a 4bbl and headers, you can clear 300 horses without any trouble at all.

The comp cams 268 is awesome. it’s a tad wilder than the 256h I went with, but I only did that because I have an 18 foot long cruiser and not a street car.

Here’s a quick article I wrote on the 318. it has basically general stuff but I wrote it, anyhow.

http://voices.yahoo.com/performance-...28.html?cat=27

Brother Mopar

If I deck it to at least make sure its square, how serious would you say the customizing will be for the intake?

Brother Mopar

As much as I dream of a car turning heads while still two blocks away that just blows everyone else out of the water, I def try to keep myself in check. Most the stations around my house are at $4 for regular right now.

In the forums I belong to for my current little 4 cylinder DD, people have talked about forced induction being able to help with gas mileage if you can control your driving. Is this true and does it apply to a 1970s V8 as well?

Brother Mopar

Thanks, man, good article. Made me feel like Im at least starting off on the right path.

Picking a cam has been one of the more iffy parts and Ive been making choices based purely on the opinion of others with more experience than myself, so Ill def keep looking at the CC268.

How would you compare fitting some 360 heads vs using the swirl port #302 casting heads for the 318 and enlarging the valves?

Coronet 500

My next engine will be a 318 for my car, maybe naturally aspirated high rpm 3.31 stroke or turbocharged, both built for power the cubes will be the only gas saving component. New turbocharged fuel injected engines out do any thing that I thought I'd see on the street as a young man 30 yrs ago. With the right components a '70s engine with turbo can give you power and fuel economy, a piston is a piston, it doesn't know how old the block is.

Don't overlook that XE 275 HL, my son really likes it for the short stroke.

Your head question goes to what RPM range TQ and rear gear do you want.

The 302's with stock valve or no bigger than 1.80" + 1.60" will keep the port velocity up and give great breakaway and low rpm pull, very snappy on the throttle. This what we did in the truck.

If I'm wanting the real power and compensating with a higher stall TQ then I'm taking the 302's adding 2.02s, hogging them out or doing the same to the 360's plus shaving them .050"-.060" or stepped pistons, going BIG cam, Big manifold, oil modifications, 1 3/4" headers and going to scare some women and children, to hell with fuel mileage.

A decent engine could be the right pistons with stock 360 heads, the right cam and even stock cast iron 4bbl manifold will get you 300-350 HP.

PK1 has some nice Magnum head build suggestions with Chevy (very available+inexpensive) stuff.

TVLynn

If you keep it to a minimum .05-010 it should still fit fine. OR take one piston in #1 TDC and measure piston deck height
do the same on 7, 2,. 8. Will give you an idea if you need to deck the block

Brother Mopar

Since its going to be a daily driver thats mostly used on streets, but will see some freeways too, Ill probably go with the 302 casting and 1.80"/1.60". (Finding a transmission with overdrive is another thing Id like to look into) Im not really sure on what would be a good compromise between keeping it drivable and getting some more power to the tires as far as the rear goes.

Id like to be in the 300-350HP range and up there with TQ as well.

Skwerly

i agree with the 302 heads. 360 heads are nice but the combustion chamber is much bigger, which will lower your compression, so you have to compensate for that somehow. 318 heads with bigger valves and a run of the mill port and polish is the way to go if you ask me.

Coronet 500

When you start talking cams and H.P./Torque the comp cam XE256H on their program, just for comparison purposes, show about 300hp and 360tq with your kind of build. When you plug in any of their bigger cams H.P. goes up Torque goes down, a little bit each time you go a little bit bigger.

I'm saying this so when you get close to cam selection look around alot and ask even more questions, but take some of the advice with a grain. That 275 is big and that 268 is pretty healthy too.

Brother Mopar

The Weiland intake lists the powerband as idle-6,000rpm, so is that right about what I should be sticking with? Ive seen a couple 318 builds mention 6,500 rpm, but then again, some of them were building it up a bit more than me.

IN CamQuest, one suggestion mentions 3.55-4.10 gears as a good fit while another mentions 3.23-3.91. Does somewhere in there sound like where I should land?

Skwerly

that's exactly right and also why i went with the 256H--i'm a torque guy, not a go-fast guy. i really enjoy driving around knowing i have the thump to yank the queen mary out of dock if i want to.

Coronet 500

You've got a heavy car there so the 3.9 and up gear will launch it like a hotrod but I doubt you'll be happy at higher speeds or freeway unless you have overdrive.

I say 3.55, 3.23 is great for highway and good all around. If you don't get the overdrive then 3.23 for sure in a car.

To Skwerly:
We've got a barge here and might be getting another. My son's friends say I'll have to lengthen the dock if we get another.

Brother Mopar

I believe I read elsewhere on this site that certain trucks came with a transmission that might fit and comes with overdrive. Id like to have a manual, but in the name of keeping my average drive in mind, an automatic with overdrive would be best most likely.

So 3.55 would be good if I get the overdrive and 3.23 if I dont? Check, Ill add it to my list Im keeping of all this stuff.

Does this seem like the right settings for using CamQuest to check out different options:

Usage:Street machines, rough idle, 9:1 min CR
Set compression ratio: 9.5:1
intake:1.80
exhaust: 1.60
Intake Manifold: Domestic dual plane, high flow
INduction airtflow: 660 cfm
Exhaust: large tube headers w/cat and mufflers

Brother Mopar

Id like to stick with the stock torque converter if possible, but thats another thing Im not too sure about. I need to look up some info about the stock one...

Coronet 500

Looks ok to me, I,d substitute rough idle and large tube headers just to see how their suggestions change.

Don't go buying a gear yet because the cam and torque convertor will have lots to do with the choice. Tire size too, don't be shy to calculate with a big tire and a 3.73 ratio just to compare rpm ranges for cam selection. It all has to come together to make a great package.

Brother Mopar

So Ive gone through probably 20 camshafts now, and here are the three that I think are providing me with good results. Would you recommend getting any of the kits offered for certain cams as well? (Rocker arms, lifters, timing set, etc?)


XE275HL(This one worries me because the valve lift is .525/.525)
388 HP @ 6500
371.5 TQ @ 4500

XE256H:
369 HP @ 6000
386 TQ @ 4000

XE268H:
384 HP @ 6000
378 TQ @ 4500

Coronet 500

I like the 268 for what your wanting for the car. I used the 256 in the truck with the 901 springs, retainers and locks. Used the 4726 tool on the head and ones for my son to fit seals but also to cut guide down for more clearance. Worked great, highly recommended and done with a hand drill 3/8" arbor.

http://www.compcams.com/catalog/COMP...g_2012_362.pdf


That 275 is tempting but get a high stall TQ, steep gear and kiss MPG goodbye.

Skwerly

i'd definitely go with the 256 or 268--you are NOT going to want something way too wild. either of those two cams will do well for ya on pump gas and be reliable as heck.

Coronet 500, you liked the 256 cam, eh? very noticeable gains in grunt?

Brother Mopar

268 going once, twice, sold!~

Ok, I didnt buy it just yet, but I think you guys are right. haha


For the performance Im going for, and with the set up Im putting together, should I look into the lifters/cam kits or even the lifters/springs/seals/etc kits that are offered? Does that depend on the condition of the engine Im starting with as well?

Coronet 500

I like the kit idea from one manufacturer.

As far as the 256 goes, it is the best cam I have had in 35 yrs that matches this application. Maybe I'm wiser and don't over cam everything like I probably have in the past.

It's a '92 D250 with an LA, stock lock-up torque convertor 904, 3.91 9.25". I thought it was pretty spunky but always felt like it needed one more gear. We just finished putting in the other axle with new everything, Auburn LSD and a 3.55 gear. My son has been breaking it in and he says with the 3.55 it pulls harder, likely 'cause it has the engine in the right rpm range to use the torque. Very happy with the XE series cam.

slade

have you thought about 340 x heads or even j heads?

Brother Mopar

I havent looked into it much. Is there any machining or anything needed to make them fit?

slade

no they will bolt right up all LA sb heads will. x heads are the best factory heads

DodgeAddict

The cylinders will need notched to clear the valves with X & J heads with 2.02

Why not use 92-up Magnum heads Roller rockers are cheap great valves & combustion chambers

What converter are you using & what gears

slade

ive never heard of such a thing

DodgeAddict

What haven't you heard of?

Notching the cylinders?

Well let's see, you take a pair of 40+ year old castings (most likely been milled to death already or close to it) & do all the required machine work which will be surfacing & valves/springs with a 2.02 valve

You have a 3.91 maybe 3.9130 bore & a higher lift camshaft

Mostly depends on the thickness of the head gasket & how far the heads have been milled

I learned this 30-35 years ago while we were building a car for stock class racing in the dirt