newto440

I have Been batteling an intake vaccum leak. This is on a '77 440. What is the correct procedure in assembling the heads and intake. I have tried all the variation of gasket and valley pan that I can think of. I now have the heads remilled and the intake redone. What kind of adhesive should I use? I read on the MOPAR PARTS FORUM that RTV is not compatible with gas? Thanks.

TVLynn

Heads re milled ??? Did you mill the head or the intake side ?

newto440

Both.

newto440

I have not assembled the engine since everything has. Been remilled. I tried a few times and never Wa s able to eliminated the vaccum. Leak on no. 8. I am a little gun shy right now. I just need some experienced advice.

trenseter

where is the leak on #8 ? and how do you know its leaking?

RacerHog

Mock Assemble the unit and check the fit.....
I use (Poster Board) from the local hobby store....
When your happy with that.. Then you can put it together with confidence.

Are you using the steel valley pan and gasket shim?

newto440

I used a can of starting fluid and sprayed it sparingly and the engine sped up on no. 8. It does not react on the left bank, just the right rear. I just might used the poster board test. Does this. Sound OK. I am thinking on putting the heads on, finger tight the head bolts. Install the valley pan, with the gaskaciinch bStuff torque it up and then torque the head bolts. It just seems to me that if I pull the heads against the intake manifold rather then trying to stretch the intake to the heads is a better way. I can measure the space between the intake manifold and the heads using the poster board and feeler gauges. Just to let you know, this is my sixth attempt at putting this THIS THING together, a leak everything time on no 8. I tried gaskets in every configuration. I need some advice. Thanks.

RacerHog

No need to Torque anything now.....
Just mock it up and check the fit!!!!!!!
2- bolts in each head
4- bolts in each corner of the intake
AND CHECK IT !!!!!!!!!!!!! WHAT DO YOU SEE????

After your sure it looks good I'll go on....

newto440

When you say "looks good" I think that you mean, it will have a good impression (even) on all gasket surfaces. Correct?

RacerHog

Pay close attention to the manifold...
If when you set the intake down on the heads..... If the flats at the ends of the engine block touch first, your going to have a gap at the intake surface and the intake manifold surface..
If after you install the 4-corner intake bolts. Look to see how much gap (If any) is now between the intake and the head mating surface? If the gap is more than the gasket can seal. Then we need to figure out whats up...
Does that make since?

newto440

Yes it does make sense. I have tried three different manifolds. Now everything is squared (maybe). I will be putting this thing back together shortly, I'll let you know.

RacerHog

http://www.permatex.com/products/our...he-right-stuff

ok.....

I like this stuff..... ^

A little on both sides of the intake ports and water jackets and a little bead on the ends of the engine block, with a little extra in each corner of the valley pan...

I like to Torque from the inside working to the out side for the intake Manifold bolts when I do these... But that's just me....

Good Luck

Keep us posted

RacerHog

Dick.....You have a PM....Call Me

moe7404

do you have the head pins in the block?

RacerHog

newto440's

Well after a long talk on the phone with (newto440's)
There might be hope to get his problem straightened out?
newto440's..... How you working out here? have you got that # 8 Cylinder leak fixed yet?

Moe...He had the Dowl pins in the block.
He has had this problem with 3 different intake installations on the same engine, and can not get it sealed on the # 8 intake with all 3 manifold. So he has had the heads and the best intake sent out to be machined for fit and straightness. He is fit testing everything to make sure the alignments are correct. He is hoping to get this together this weekend. Will See?
But, if the mock up comes back wrong... ?????????? (shyyyyy)

PK1

good thread. great advice. Hope he reports back... My curiosity is peaked!

newto440

Well, we assembled the engine after getting the heads and intake back from the machine shop. Now we are having a problem with the Holley carb (lst 3667) when the engine starts the carb floods out of the breather on top of the float bowl. We had the carb rebuilt, Didn't help. Check the new fuel pump and it is putting out 6-7 psi. Changed float settings, same result. Check the brass/metal floats in gas and they do float at about 2/3 deep in the gas, no sound of fluid in them when they were shook. Changed the needle and seats, didn't work, still floods. Today we are going to switch the floats front vs back and then see. I am running out of ideas other then buying a new carb.. Inj the mean time we have gone through 3 sets of "O" rings for that transfer tube.

Now everything has to wait, the Vikings are on right now, maybe some day we will find out if the intake leak has been fixed. See ya, Semper Fi.

RacerHog

Sounds like the needles and seats are just not seating...... Way weird !!!

Take the carb off and turn it up side down and blow threw the fuel inlet and make sure the needle is sealing in the seat....

newto440

I will try thast next, I've decided to take the day off. Vikings lost 31 to 30 vs Da Bears in the last few seconds. I may start Monday. See ya later Bob..

RacerHog

Here is the thick gasket it you need it.... Mr.Gasket 5841

http://www.summitracing.com/parts/mr.../make/chrysler

newto440

The carb is now fixed. We went to the Carb Shop and he sold me a fuel regulator that cuts the fuel pump pressure to 4 1/2 psi, he says that 6-7 psi is way to muchfor that carb. Installed it and it works, no leaks, no floding. Problem taken care of.

Intake, still leaks after all this fooling around, six times we have put that thing together. No. 8. I pulled the plug wire and it makes no difference in the idle, still runs rough. Sprayed carb cleaner on the intake at no.8 and it speeds right up, then goes back to missing. I can't pull more then 13/14 pounds of vacuum. After talking with "Racerhog" I am going to loosen the intake manifold then retighten starting at no.8 (ignoring the correct sequence to torque, it hasn't worked) and work my way forward. If that doesn't do it. Racerhog has given me info on a heavier gasket. See ya.

RacerHog

I will have to say.... This one has me stumped...... This should have been as easy as a walk in the park.....
3 Different intake manifolds.... all leak at the number 8 intake along with all the gaskets....
Then took the heads and the best fitting intake to the machine shop to have them all set straight.... Put it all back together and still it wont seal.... Dam
So if this 0.060 gasket dont work... Some thing is way wrong.....

New to 440's..... Check and make sure the intake bolts are not bottoming out in the heads... I know...Last minute thought.....lol

newto440

We loosened the intake bolts like we talked about, retighened them from rear right-to-front then did the left side. At about 1500rpm we are pulling 18/19inches of vacuum. At idle we are pulling about 16 inches. I am sort of happy but it still isn't correct. Maybe close enough. The thought of pulling the manifold again doesn't excite me. It doesn't speed up (like it use to) when squirted with carb cleaner. I'll just sit on it for awhile, I have the web site for the thicker gasket saved.

Thanks again for all of your help Bob. If you get any more ideas let me know, One thing. We tried the shaving cream, didn't see anything. Good idea though. Dick................

RacerHog

Well Progress in the rite direction I suppose.....
But Wow... Some fight you have had on your hands....
You know...I'm going to guess that this engine has been overhauled and somehow the parts machined all got out of square. And you got stuck with the fits.... Drive it and get it up nice and hot and then make sure their tight.

Keep us posted
Bob

RacerHog

Carb Issue...... That Was it...