jonaid

I have a strange problem. My 440 engine has never giving me problems before but now I am having some issues. It has not run much for quite a few years and now I am restoring the truck it is in and cleaning up some odds and ends. So I was checking exhaust temps at the header flange and noticed #7 is only at 200-250 degrees while all of the others are 450-600 degrees. Rpms over 2000 and there is a clatter in the area above #7. Comp check on cold engine is 125# or close across all cylinders with forged Pistons. Visual inspection with valley pan removed everything looks normal while rotating. Bore scope in seven looks ok, doesn't look like piston is hitting the valves. The rattle and low temp leads me to think it is a lifter problem and my next step is to test the lifters. Thought I would see what everyone else thinks. Thanks.

RacerHog

May just need some run time to pump back up.... If that dont do it... Your on the rite track... Just my 2 cents...

jonaid

Thanks for the reply. No one around here can or doesn't want to test lifters so I guess I will replace all of them. The engine has not run much in the last twenty years and was initially put together about 35 years ago. Everything else looks good that I can see, I have pulled the oil pan and now looking into the lifter valley. I guess it will not hurt to replace the lifters. Thank you.

Iowan

On your last oil change did you happen to switch brands or viscosity of the oil or filter?

jonaid

I did switch oil but the problem was there before and afterwards. I had some synthetic in it then though better of it and replaced with a oil that has zinc in it. I have run it so infrequently in the last few years that it is hard to point to anything specifically. There have been extended periods of time when it has not even run in the last twenty years, I am just glad everything else looks good that has been inspected. I have some new lifters on the way, I will find out more then.

Iowan

Putting new lifters on a old cam is a 5/10 shot for failure but I give a new cam about a 9/10 shot of not going flat,
quality and viscosity of oil is key.

jonaid

I have switched to Valvoline Vr1 20-50, that's what I used to use but did try one change on mobil one synthetic but was getting some leaks so I switched back. I was also concerned with what you brought up. The cam that's in there probably has about 25,000 miles on it. I will have to think about your advice, thanks

Iowan

Don't misunderstand my negative thoughts on the flat tappet cam but it's everywhere. In the past I would not have put new lifters on an old cam but I would be tempted to try and get by with it today. I've never had a cam go flat and I've built everything from mild to wild, I personally think the Chinese cam cores are junk and that's why there going flat. But then again I've heard more stories about roller lifter failures both solid and hydraulic mostly the retrofit cams.

Iowan

Don't misunderstand my negative thoughts on the flat tappet cam but it's everywhere. In the past I would not have put new lifters on an old cam but I would be tempted to try and get by with it today. I've never had a cam go flat and I've built everything from mild to wild, I personally think the Chinese cam cores are junk and that's why there going flat. But then again I've heard more stories about roller lifter failures both solid and hydraulic mostly the retrofit cams.

jonaid

I appreciate your thoughts. I do not remember what cam I put in, a more aggressive rv grind. I was building for torque at the time but as long ago as it was and I am sure I used a good one, so it should be good steel.

jonaid

I am going to use comp cams regular lifters and good lube so hopefully all will be well.

Stevem

Besides it sounding like you do have a failed lifter your low cranking compression of only 125 psi show that the cam was installed retarded or now is retarded for sure!

did you degree the cam back when you put this motor together?

what condition is the chain in, you should take a look.

if it’s a roller chain type that you put on the gears without first soaking the chain in a light oil over night then I can near guarantee you that the chain is worn / stretched making for retarted timing all on its own.
it takes a long run time for oil to get into the rollers if you do not prelube then right.
oiling the chain with a oil squirt can one it’s on the gears just does not get the job done.




it’s been seen that many of the roller timing chain gears are not made right also, so degreeing must be done.

You should not just assume that everything is correct!

if your going to stuff in a new cam and lifters which I think your situation does call for then a product called Oil extreme is what I would use over a break in additive.

getting back to the compression situation, you should be having a minimum of 150 to 160 psi if your static compression is 9 to 1.

jonaid

I was wondering about the low compression. I do remember it was a cloyes double roller with the ability to retard or advance the cam easily. I had messed around with that back in the day trying g to find what worked best for me. I was thinking about checking that but will for sure now. I was a stickler for doing everything properly when I put it together but it's worth a check. Thank you.

Stevem

You can easily test out if that cam lobe with the failed lifter that’s on it is good by this process.

pull all the plugs out and crank the engine over with the starter.
When a valve opens and closes you will see the lifter and push rod spin if the lifter and cam lobe are good.
if you then place a lifter that you have seen spin in place of that failed lifter and it does not spin, then it’s time for a new cam for sure.

also when doing this test out if you see some lifters/ push rods spinning slower then others that will be a sign that those lifters and lobes are on borrowed time anyway.

if you dry off the oil from the push rods in a little spot and apply a dot of white paint it will be easier to see there spin rate.

jonaid

That was one of the first things I checked when I opened it up. All of those checked out but I will dbl. check again, never hurts. Thank you

jonaid

Well good call, timing chain was very loose. I will get another set and make sure to degree it in when I start reassembling.

Stevem

That’s good news to hear!
be sure to pre-lube the **** out of it and also do a cranking compression test on all 8 cylinders to keep for future reference as the motor ages.

jonaid

Good idea, it could be a few weeks before I get it all back together but I will update at that time. Have to a good weekend.

jonaid

Well a few weeks have turned into a few months. Ran into some other odds and ends but so far the engine looks good, except for a rear main seal oil leak. Runs great, sounds strong and compression has been good, all cylinders have compression around 135-140. Now to just fix that oil leak! Always something I guess.

Kuvasz101

My experience with rear main seals have more than often proven NOT to be the rear main seal. Just be careful and really check it's not coming from a higher source.

jonaid

Yes, I have triple checked and plan on at least two more checks. The valve covers look tight and the oil sender looks good. But some more checking before I think about the main seal.

RacerHog

Good to hear you got things back up and running.... Hope you get the oil leak fixed.... And, yep!!! Its always something !!!!