Considering '49 Chrysler Windsor project
05-01-2013, 07:39 PM
#1
Considering '49 Chrysler Windsor project
Hi, forum.
I posted back in March about a 1963 New Yorker possible project that -- at least for now, it might still be available -- I've passed on due to extensive rust underneath and an unexplained leak from the 413.
But, this car just became available right in my hometown.
The owner says he bought this 1949 Chrysler Windsor coupe in Oklahoma City a couple of years ago intending to undertake a mostly factory-original restoration. When he and an engine shop determined the original Spitfire Six was just a boat anchor, and he couldn't readily find a replacement, he scrapped most of it and the Fluid Drive transmission, thinking even the transmission was useless to him or to anyone because he said it was Spitfire Six-specific and the engines were "impossible" to find. (He also bought a 1950 Plymouth four-door with flat six and a three-speed, but sold it at a small loss when he discovered its engine wouldn't mate to the Fluid Drive in the Windsor.)
So, what we have now is a roller. It's semi-solid, with rust problems readily identified around the trunk rim and low on the tail, a few perforations in the floorboards, some bubbles around the rear window and on the rockers, a bullet hole(?) in the right rear fender, etc.
The back seat is out of the car, but comes in the deal and is similar in condition to the front, a little rough on the cloth seat-back but surprisingly good condition on the vinyl lower portion. It was removed to determine the extent of the floorboard rust. The upholstered part of the dash looks like crud, but the chromed and gilded portions of the dash and the steering wheel emblem are quite presentable. ... That wheel and instrument cluster are what really piqued my interest; unique, flashy and classy. ... The owner says the dash clock still worked last time the car had a battery.
It has one missing chrome piece (right front fender), with the other visible missing chrome piece (right belt line) off the car but actually included in the deal. The exterior chrome is very pitted, however, pretty much overall except the bumpers themselves, which are pretty clean.
The car has new glass in the doors (both windows and vents). The original head and air cleaner are in the trunk, not that they're useful in this application without a Spitfire Six.
The owner has talked of the ease of a 350 Chevy swap, though I'd think beyond engine and trans you'd need a different rear end, too. (Wouldn't you think?) ... He said he's done measurements that suggest one could drop the body onto an S-10 frame if you so desired.
Owner says he'd like to get $1,500 for it, which would be (he says) taking a loss of more than $1,000 because he supposedly gave $2,500 for the car in the first place a couple of years ago. (Plus the new glass, plus a slight loss on flipping his would-be donor Plymouth.)
If the Spitfire Six or similar vintage Chrysler flathead with Fluid Drive indeed would be a scarce combination, a driveline swap would make sense. But I dislike the notion of mixing manufacturers in most cases. Personally I'd want to devise a Mopar solution.
So I ask the forum: What do you think of this project? What's a fair price? ... Has anyone on the forum undertaken a driveline swap on this vintage of Windsor or similar? If so (or if not) what did you do or would you want to try?
I'm guessing almost anything from a 318 to a 383 would be fairly available and feasible, though I haven't at all measured whether they'd fit between the front fenders. Even in an "easy swap" scenario it would seem a fair amount of fabrication would be in order.
Below is the pic the owner is advertising.
The rest of my few pics are at Photobucket.
I posted back in March about a 1963 New Yorker possible project that -- at least for now, it might still be available -- I've passed on due to extensive rust underneath and an unexplained leak from the 413.
But, this car just became available right in my hometown.
The owner says he bought this 1949 Chrysler Windsor coupe in Oklahoma City a couple of years ago intending to undertake a mostly factory-original restoration. When he and an engine shop determined the original Spitfire Six was just a boat anchor, and he couldn't readily find a replacement, he scrapped most of it and the Fluid Drive transmission, thinking even the transmission was useless to him or to anyone because he said it was Spitfire Six-specific and the engines were "impossible" to find. (He also bought a 1950 Plymouth four-door with flat six and a three-speed, but sold it at a small loss when he discovered its engine wouldn't mate to the Fluid Drive in the Windsor.)
So, what we have now is a roller. It's semi-solid, with rust problems readily identified around the trunk rim and low on the tail, a few perforations in the floorboards, some bubbles around the rear window and on the rockers, a bullet hole(?) in the right rear fender, etc.
The back seat is out of the car, but comes in the deal and is similar in condition to the front, a little rough on the cloth seat-back but surprisingly good condition on the vinyl lower portion. It was removed to determine the extent of the floorboard rust. The upholstered part of the dash looks like crud, but the chromed and gilded portions of the dash and the steering wheel emblem are quite presentable. ... That wheel and instrument cluster are what really piqued my interest; unique, flashy and classy. ... The owner says the dash clock still worked last time the car had a battery.
It has one missing chrome piece (right front fender), with the other visible missing chrome piece (right belt line) off the car but actually included in the deal. The exterior chrome is very pitted, however, pretty much overall except the bumpers themselves, which are pretty clean.
The car has new glass in the doors (both windows and vents). The original head and air cleaner are in the trunk, not that they're useful in this application without a Spitfire Six.
The owner has talked of the ease of a 350 Chevy swap, though I'd think beyond engine and trans you'd need a different rear end, too. (Wouldn't you think?) ... He said he's done measurements that suggest one could drop the body onto an S-10 frame if you so desired.
Owner says he'd like to get $1,500 for it, which would be (he says) taking a loss of more than $1,000 because he supposedly gave $2,500 for the car in the first place a couple of years ago. (Plus the new glass, plus a slight loss on flipping his would-be donor Plymouth.)
If the Spitfire Six or similar vintage Chrysler flathead with Fluid Drive indeed would be a scarce combination, a driveline swap would make sense. But I dislike the notion of mixing manufacturers in most cases. Personally I'd want to devise a Mopar solution.
So I ask the forum: What do you think of this project? What's a fair price? ... Has anyone on the forum undertaken a driveline swap on this vintage of Windsor or similar? If so (or if not) what did you do or would you want to try?
I'm guessing almost anything from a 318 to a 383 would be fairly available and feasible, though I haven't at all measured whether they'd fit between the front fenders. Even in an "easy swap" scenario it would seem a fair amount of fabrication would be in order.
Below is the pic the owner is advertising.
The rest of my few pics are at Photobucket.
09-21-2013, 04:44 PM
#6
I am in the process of restoring a 1952 New Yorker.
And i have a spare engine and transmission. 331 cid + 4 speed tip-toe
The actual condition of the engine is not known yet as i have just picked it up this morning and it is still in the pickup box. Only parts missing are the distributor and the water pump and one manifold (right side).
The transmission a have done a partial tear down.
Torque needs to be cleaned, front pump gear and ring must be changed but the rest is good, clutch needs to be unfrozen from the splines.
It was stored in a garage but, last owner says it`s just stuck, wasn't jammed when he pulled it from the doner in 1989. Oil pan needs to have the bumps taken as we did bang it when we hauled it from the garage.
My buddies never thought that this engine was so heavy, neither did I.
I also have 2 brake boosters, a differential and some front end components.
PM if you would need some stuff.
And i have a spare engine and transmission. 331 cid + 4 speed tip-toe
The actual condition of the engine is not known yet as i have just picked it up this morning and it is still in the pickup box. Only parts missing are the distributor and the water pump and one manifold (right side).
The transmission a have done a partial tear down.
Torque needs to be cleaned, front pump gear and ring must be changed but the rest is good, clutch needs to be unfrozen from the splines.
It was stored in a garage but, last owner says it`s just stuck, wasn't jammed when he pulled it from the doner in 1989. Oil pan needs to have the bumps taken as we did bang it when we hauled it from the garage.
My buddies never thought that this engine was so heavy, neither did I.
I also have 2 brake boosters, a differential and some front end components.
PM if you would need some stuff.
05-13-2014, 12:52 PM
#7
By the way, I bought this car but have moved to Wisconsin. It's still stuck in Kansas, though I hope to go back and get it soon.
I've run into frame rust issues, surprising because the body seemed pretty solid.
I did get a drivetrain from a salvage yard auction: A built 360 with 727 yanked from a hot-rod Dodge half-ton.
Now to get it here, resolve the frame issues, and get it all put together.
I've run into frame rust issues, surprising because the body seemed pretty solid.
I did get a drivetrain from a salvage yard auction: A built 360 with 727 yanked from a hot-rod Dodge half-ton.
Now to get it here, resolve the frame issues, and get it all put together.
05-14-2014, 06:12 AM
#8
Mopar Lover
Well Glen, Thanks for the update. Hope you get your project home soon. Sounds like a fun neat car. Hope to see more pictures of it soon.....
By the way... What possessed you to move to Wisconsin? Hope it wasn't the Cheese!!!!!!!
By the way... What possessed you to move to Wisconsin? Hope it wasn't the Cheese!!!!!!!
Last edited by RacerHog; 05-14-2014 at 06:17 AM.
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